Police Lacerate Army Ranger’s Spleen and Cause Internal Bleeding … Then Deny Him Medical Treatment for 18 Hours
Reuters notes:
A former U.S. Army Ranger and Occupy Oakland protester was in intensive care on Friday after a veterans group said he was beaten by police during clashes with demonstrators this week.
The veteran, identified as Kayvan Sabeghi, was the second former American serviceman during the past two weeks to be badly hurt in confrontations between anti-Wall Street protesters and police in Oakland.
The group Iraq Veterans Against the War said Sabeghi was detained during disturbances that erupted late on Wednesday in downtown Oakland and was charged with resisting arrest and remaining present at the place of a riot.
Highland General Hospital confirmed that Sabeghi was a patient in the intensive care unit there.
Brian Kelly, who co-owns a brew pub with Sabeghi, said his business partner served as an Army Ranger in Iraq and Afghanistan. He said Sabeghi told him he was arrested and beaten by a group of policemen as he was leaving the protest to go home.
“He told me he was in the hospital with a lacerated spleen and that the cops had jumped him,” Kelly said. “They put him in jail, and he told them he was injured, and they denied him medical treatment for about 18 hours.”
The Guardian reports:
Kayvan Sabehgi, who served in Iraq and Afghanistan, is in intensive care with a lacerated spleen. He says he was beaten by police close to the Occupy Oakland camp, but despite suffering agonising pain, did not reach hospital until 18 hours later.
***
Sabehgi told the Guardian from hospital he was walking alone along 14th Street in central Oakland – away from the main area of clashes – when he was injured.
“There was a group of police in front of me,” he told the Guardian from his hospital bed. “They told me to move, but I was like: ‘Move to where?’ There was nowhere to move.
“Then they lined up in front of me. I was talking to one of them, saying ‘Why are you doing this?’ when one moved forward and hit me in my arm and legs and back with his baton. Then three or four cops tackled me and arrested me.”
Sabeghi … said he was handcuffed and placed in a police van for three hours before being taken to jail. By the time he got there he was in “unbelievable pain”.
***
Sabehgi was due to undergo surgery on Friday afternoon to repair his spleen, which would involve using a clot or patch to prevent internal bleeding.
***
Some protesters had set fire to a hastily assembled barrier at the corner of 16th Street and Telegraph, in a bid to prevent access to the occupied building, but police drove demonstrators away from 16th Street using tear gas, flashbang grenades, and non-lethal rounds.
Sabehgi said he had not been in the occupied building, and was walking away from the main area of trouble when he was injured.
He said he had his arms folded and was “totally peaceful” before being arrested.
Local San Francisco ABC affiliate KOFY News interviewed Sabehgi’s sister tonight, who said that Sabehgi lived near Frank Ogawa Plaza (the center of the Occupy protests), and was walking home Wednesday night away from violence when police stopped him. Sabehgi said that police ordered him to walk in another direction, and he simply asked “why?”
In response, according to Sabehgi’s sister, the police beat him mercilessly with batons.
Sabehgi was then kept in a holding cell for 18 hours. Despite begging to see a doctor, Sabehgi was refused medical assistance. Instead, according to Sabehgi, his jailors accused Sabehgi without any cause of being a heroin addict and alcoholic and – instead of providing medical help for his severe injuries – told him to stop taking heroin.
There is apparently a videotape of the incident (KOFY noted that “police are reviewing video of the incident”).
Given the outcry over the unprovoked injury of Marine veteran Scott Olsen – which has caused veterans from all over the country to come out to support the protesters – Sabehgi’s treatment by the police could generate even more support for the “Occupy” protests .
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Gee. I wonder if he’s got some friends among the Rangers.
Who can stop this “police”? The courts? Even more demonstrators? Voting? Are we already a third-world country?
So Peter T, if you don’t look white Anglo middle class in the US of A, you’ve _always_ lived in a Third World country where police abuse is a constant threat, _regardless of your conduct_. Street reprisal and denial of medical care are routine in many police systems, especially in large cities; there are regularly deaths due to the latter, and lawsuits. It’s just that no one listens very much it at all if it’s a shaggy black man who’s beaten to a pulp for ‘disrespect.’
In case anyone doesn’t know it, a ruptured spleen can kill you, and can kill you in 24 hours. Kayvan Sabeghi’s life was much more at risk than Scott Olsen’s, not to make much of the comparison. According to one report I’ve read, after hours of being in too much pain to stand up he made bail, but was still in too much pain to get up and so to leave (which is unsurprising for an internal organ injury, they’re f**kin’ painful), and he was left to lie there for a further six hours until the cops finally called an ambulance to drag him away. Think of what would have happened if he hadn’t made bail: he’d have died before they did anything.
Now the cops who beat him into a life threatening injury for not being as respectful/intimidated by them as they thought he should be will very likely get off scot-free because this is the way the injustice system works if a cop assaults you while having a semi-good excuse tied around their arm. A lawsuit is coming for Alameda County, who jailed Sabeghi, and believe me, it’ll be a doozy. That would be no compensation if he’d died, but it’s the recourse we have.
Those on the fringes of the Occupations elsewhere have experienced these kinds of assaults in other areas, notably Denver. Now, some of those folks are pretty fringy, and some of them are cop-baiters, but police using the circumstances as an opportunity to put people they may not like in the hospital with life-threatening injuries are not needed in the uniform of public service.
Unfortunately, Richard is completely correct here.
I was talking to one of my friends about this recently. As some of you may recall I am biracial (and look “not white” enough for some people out there), and I’ve been harrassed and nearly assaulted by police for no reason (things like driving home late because I’m a doctor… they were certain I was on drugs).
Anyway, he said “I guess it’s nice that finally white people are getting the same treatment, huh?”
I was shocked into silence. Nothing could be further from the truth. My hope is not for others to share the problems that minorities face, but instead for the problems to be resolved. Safety and human dignity are the most essential of human rights and we as a society are moving AWAY from these as goals.
Sure, at times it is nice to see that some sheltered non-minorities finally understand a part of what minorities go through vis a vis discrimination, and the fact that yes it really is hard to be black in America… but that’s a pyrrhic victory at best.
Someone else has posted this thought recurrently, and it has resonated with me. We have militarized our police force. Some (many?) are no longer “defenders” of anything, instead they are aggressors. How can we as regular people tell which is which? How can we have a functioning society if/when we can’t even trust the police?
what’s next, coopt the doctors to not treat Occupiers who come in with splenic injuries so that the Occupiers die, and then coopt the medical examiner so that we can officially declare it was a Heroin overdose?
So Yearning, I had both your friend’s and your own reaction. Maybe those who never realize how much at risk minorities are from police abuse will have the light go on from them due to this wretched incident with Kayvan Sabhegi. But then no, no one deserves that kind of treatment, and there is no present evidence to indicate he did anything at all to provoke such abuse—and even if he did, it’s still grossly unacceptable abuse, of anyone, for any reason.
It’s tough being a minority in a majority country; it’s a grind being black in the US. Everyone who looks or is ‘black’ in this country knows someone or has personally had the experience of ending up _with their life at risk_ just for being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Seriously at risk, not least from the police, for doing nothing at all. That weighs on a person, and those of us who don’t look like that or have that experience need to understand the effect it has on those who have to live with that ongoingly.
Four blocks away from where this happened, those who grow up in West Oakland, the toughest inner city I ever saw until I went through central Baltimore some ten years ago, would understand that simply encountering four heavily armed police at 1:00 AM _is_ a life threatening encounter, regardless of the whiff of revolution in the background. I’m sure that you understand this too, Yearning. I very much doubt that Kayvan grasped this, a few blocks from his residence, secure in the knowledge that he’s doing the right thing in his activsm (he is),and having lived in far more overtly dangerous circumstances overseas. If there is learning for those in the Occupation to come out of this it’s that the police can get worked up enough to put you in the hospital, even if they weren’t plain bad cops looking for the chance, so one has to be aware and practice personal security when anywhere near or involved with a political action or presence.
I am a veteran too. I was a recon specialist with the army from 1986 to 1991.
Based on my experiences, there are SOME cops that almost see you as a threat. I suppose, given the training we had, that we are BUT most of us are also the least likely to ignore the order of a police officer, resist arrest or create a violant incident.
I’ve wondered what the result would be were a group of veterans go to a protest in Battle Dress Uniform, gas mask, helmet and with ballistic shields. I suspect that we would get shot because even an ad hoc group of combat arms veterans could work together well enough to resist almost any police force assault for an extended period of time.
Likely never happen of course but I have often wondered what an angry, unemployed group of combat vets could do given a leader and access to the kinds of arms they were trained with? Blackwater? Reminds me of the private companies that used to roam Europe providing security and contracting to augment armies.
Probably one of the reasons that vets get hiring preference for Fed jobs.
re “hiring preference”, that’s exactly why the troops withdrawn from Iraq are going to be sent to some other outpost rather than brought home.
Where are the jobs?
Daniel:
What you have suggested is exactly what this country needs.
While I’m white, and don’t really know about racist treatment, except for that time in Hawaii when a group of big Samoans called me “Honkey” and forced me to cross the street to keep from getting my honkey ass smashed like potatoes, it’s going to take a group of vets to set these cops right.
I mean real right. When they confront a group of trained patriotic killers who give them better than they can dish out, then things will begin to be set aright.
I’m thinking that fire bombing police stations will happen in the not too distant future and then they will draw blood and the battle will be joined and those fat, over paid slobs who are the legal gangs will know that Americans are not going to submit to their terror anymore without taking them out in large numbers. It’ll be Libya all over again.
It’s going to take some patriotic brothers to start the war and the 99ers will join in.
Stand your ground. History is callin you!
Patriot American,
After reading this story, I too want to to out and ensure, using the skills I learned in the Marines, that none of my brothers and sisters fighting the good fight are needlessly harmed. Your idea has merit- I think the mere sight would scare a lot of people- people who need to feel a little fear in their hearts right now. Let’s reflect, however, on what reactions that fear might motivate:
1) It would get a lot of media attention which would increase support among those already sympathetic to OWS.
2)However, it would certainly be percieved as an escalation toward violence by those already opposed to OWS, even though this ‘armored brigade’ act absolutely peacefully and lawfully…
3) …also being held up as an ‘alarming development by Limbaugh, Fox, and Greater Wingnuttia et al. inevitably ‘reminiscent of 1923 Munich’ etc., ad nauseam…
4)…getting even more innocent heads busted by the inevitable reaction from policemen and right-wing mobs.
There are still several million extreme right-wingers in the USA. They have a great deal of fear in their hearts and even more nonsense filling their heads. They tend to be well-armed compared to the rest of us. They have their own social networks and can organize just as quickly as we can.
The right wingers also have one great advantage which OWS lacks. Their wealthiest members have unparallelled influence on every level of government in the USA- they hold the levers of power and unlimited money.
The greatest weakness of this right-wing elite is the spectacle of overreaction. When the powerful can’t tolerate a lawful, peaceful assemblage simply because it is critical of them, that sends a strong signal to the wavering and the unaligned- that we are ruled by a corrupt and fearful group. And if they are revealed to enough of the populace as such, they will be replaced.
I encourage veterans to go to to OWS. Do everything you can not to provoke violence. Restrain your fellows who would. Keep your faces uncovered. Use your voices and not your hands. Share your knowledge and your experience. If threatened unreasonably by force of arms or law, be peaceful, for you are in the right, and the world is watching.
So Daniel and Patriot American, I do think that veterans have a great deal to offer the Occupiers and the Zones of Occupation, though not primarily as you suggest. It’s very, very tempting to think of organizing a physical squad to counter police action; I feel the tug toward that, and I’m not a veteran at all. But it’s the wrong way to go, self-defeating as proposed, and would seriously undermine the effectiveness of the Forward Movement of the Occupation. First, nonviolence is the most potent technique available to the Occupation. There is a deliberate strategy involved; it’s not simply letting a cop paste you on camera to win sympathy. Nonviolence erodes the legitimacy of power, and as such destroys the morale of the agents of power, while it also persuades the undecided of the merit of the resistance. There are many texts on this, with a comprehensive introduction being _Waging Nonviolent Struggle_, 2005, by Gene Sharp. Second, the police are trained to escalate against physical resistance. The Daniel is right that life fire is a significant possibility, as well as a much more extensive paramilitary mobilization. This is just what The Powers That Be would _LOVE_ to launch; what they lake is any remote justification. Armed flying squads beating the cops at their own game would be just such a justification. So if you want the zones crushed and the struggle to become a quasi-armed one, which strongly favors the government and will discourage those on the margins, you could undertake no action more provocative.
But I think that vets have three things of great value to offer to the Occupations, speaking strictly for myself. First, you tactical experiences, discipline, and ability to keep your head in fearful situations would be of considerable value, yes. Small unit tactics are always the same; recon is always the same; infiltration is always the same; perimeter security is always the same; ‘fire’ discipline is always the same. These are skills that you and other vets have but that many in the Occupation are having to learn on the job. Tactical, Community Watch, and related working groups at most Occupations could really use your skills and experience _IF_ you can bring yourself to the mental position of nonviolent discipline, not to strike back physically however much you may be engaged in an action. Think about it: you folks are valuable depending upon how you choose to use your skills.
Second, I think it would be highly valuable for you all who are veterans to speak of your personal experiences to those in the Occupations. Many of you who are veterans are from smaller communities or places out of the spotlight, and your decision to join the military may have been driven by economics but for most of you was an expression of intrinsic patriotism as well or more so. You’ve seen what empire looks like, many of you, out at the cutting edge. Maybe some of your experiences were good and you value them; maybe some of them weren’t. And now here you are, too, in the 99% trying to get this thing fixed at home. Unlike you all, many of the most driven actors in the Occupations have never been anywhere near the military. They’re often from suburbs or big cities; a lot of them have been to college. Many of them don’t like the empire, but they haven’t actually been out there and seen what it’s like. Many of them, haven’t had the experience of leaving small towns or tough neighborhoods for the experience of a lifetime, only to come back with _your_ experiences. They need to hear what you know. Now, understand that some in the occupation are going to be very negative on the military, so you’ll come up against some attitude intially; be prepared for that in your own mind, that it’s just that other person’s personal trip. The Occupiers have been very clear in their code of conduct for community that they don’t accept discrimination against any group, certainly including past or serving military, or by the latter against others. Go as a citizen with unique experiences, others need to hear from you.
Third, your presence as veterans makes it very difficult for the Oligarchy and the confused ultra-right to smear the Occupiers as unpatriotic and ‘un-American.’ Your presence alone is a very potent endorsement of the purposes of the Occupations, and so a protection in the way of ‘facts on the ground’ of the Occupiers. But that only applies if you go with self-discipline. The police will provoke you. Agents provocateur will provoke you, or try to use you. So use your skills to say ‘on mission’ if you go.
You all veterans have a lot to offer the Occupations so long as you remember that your best weapon is your heart. I’ll see you there . . . .
Let the police and the “authorities” embarrass themselves by committing unprovoked, evil violence. Don’t even make the appearance of provoking them.
At some point, if the authorities remain incredibly stupid, thuggish, and violent, this will turn into a civil war, but we want to avoid that. Even if you think it’s inevitable, we win by avoiding it as long as possible and waiting for *the bad guys* to start it — remember Lincoln’s policy in the runup to the Civil War.
Many vets move into police work after their service. It’s really shocking to think that one or more of the group of police who attacked this young man may be former service members themselves.
I admire the OWS crew and their pacifist stance.
Mind you, if they ever graduate from being an entertaining sideshow to being a real changer of anything, then they had better be ready for live rounds. And those rounds _will_ be fired by their co-working-class-fellow-99%-ers, the police. The usual method of shipping forces in from other areas will be used, so familiar faces will not prevent the lethal lesson in power politics being delivered. And their marine, ranger and standard grunt training will be of enormous benefit to their superiors in their execution of their orders.
The ruling class will always resort to lethal force if they are really threatened in any real way.
The old saying is still true – “if voting changed anything, it would be illegal”.
Liberal democracy, what a laugh!
Yea, it’s the big fat low wage gravy train for the psychopaths to dominate common people.
There needs to be better testing to weed out these losers!
I suspect that anyone who thinks that the cops respect race and class privilege in this day and age is either a) living in the 1960’s or b) a really sheltered white liberal. Cops beat, taze and shoot people every single day for showing “disrespect.”
Seriously, there’s so much evidence to the contrary, I can’t believe someone would knowingly claim that white middle-class people are somehow immune to police abuse.
To wit, the whole Skip Gates case at Harvard — that was NOT about race, though understandably many perceived it that way. Instead, it was about cop arrogance and power tripping. Plain and simple. Unfortunately, old guys like Gates and Obama couldn’t see what was plainly before their own eyes.
Alas, Richard is correct. The deference (or servility) of judges toward law enforcement is getting beyond worrisome in the World’s Biggest Banana Republic in the Making. My wife (an ex-ICU nurse) had a devastating comment about this story: “One of them MUST die (please, heed the very heavy sarcasm dripping here) before the justice system is forced to truly punish a cop in this country.”
I was shocked to hear that from someone I’ve always known to be a very even tempered person…and she wasn’t done! “BTW sweetheart, you realize that the punishment is THIS CASE would’ve been appropriate only because the victim would’ve been a veteran from an elite military group with a past in active duty in a combat zone…right? You DO realize that, don’t you?”
As much as I wish she was wrong, I can’t find faults in her argument.
PETRR T THAT’S WHAT I WANT TO KNOW ARE THESE GOONS MERCENARIES BOUTHT BY CORPSE ??
Even worse, we are a third world country operating under the pretense of rule of law.
At least in real third world countries, the corruption is straightforward so that business may proceed knowledgeably
OK, now it is getting weird in here!
Rule of law: low level warfare aimed at all outside the ruling class to maintain the ruling class’ power and privilege.
First, second, third or underworld, it is all the same. The _nice, nice_ patina that way too may people have spent their lives skating across does not change a thing. The supposed civility of the police forces only reinforces just how cowed and tame the white population of the US truly is. Oh, and thinking the police are protecting you only means you are identifying with your leech lords. Try _crossing a line_ and you will know all about it, as OWS is just starting to learn.
And give me a break on the corruption thing. What makes anyone think the US is any less corrupt than anywhere else? Because some bureaucrats are paid enough so they don’t ask for lubrication for every minor transaction? Try spending some time in sales at the heavy end. Private enterprise is built on corruption. Back-handers are the way things get done. And if Naked Capitalism hasn’t highlighted the regulatory _capture_ to you well enough, try the archives for a refresher, or the archives of Climate Progress. The use of the word capture in this case only refers to how completely corrupted the regulators have become.
Please, we are all adults here, enough with the faux naivete.
We’re not cowed here in the US, we’re merely patient and polite.
Don’t confuse the two. Confusing the two is one of the errors made at Versailles.
Youngsters, those cops that beat Kayvan may be police but they do not deserve respect, they are asshole pigs and deserve to be treated as same. Do your google as to what we thought of pigs back in the day…
http://www.democracynow.org/2010/7/9/outrage_in_oakland_transit_officer_convicted
I am very sorry to hear about this attack on another veteran.
How sick is this folks? There are a lot more folks that are not afraid of standing up for their rights than there are police in this country.
Are the 1% and their puppets really this stupid and perverted? I guess we are finding out the hard way.
Laugh the global inherited rich out of control of our society and into rooms at the Hague. It will put an quick end to this jackboot thuggery which is a path that I don’t want to see the US go down.
“Are the 1% and their puppets really this stupid and perverted? I guess we are finding out the hard way.”
The majority of the 0.1%? Yes, this stupid and perverted. Their puppets? Definitely this stupid and perverted.
It’s not surprising. These people are *not* the “old rich”. Some inherited their money…. but most of them got their money by *stealing* it (“legally”, of course). Being thieves and having the mentality of thieves, they are stupid and perverted and surround themselves with similar people.
What other mentality would have come up with a $5 fee for people to use their own money? Stupid, perverted, but it’s the mentality of *the thief*.
Reading about this second incident made me rethink a video I saw on Occupy Phoenix, I’m sure some here have seen it. They have a group called the Border Patrol, I believe, and a guy named JT, dressed in military gear complete with semi-automatic weapons that stand guard between the OP protestors and the police. They say they are there demonstrating their 2nd Amendment right to ensure the protestors are able to demonstrate their 1st Amendment rights. I don’t know what they’d do if the police moved in with batons and chemical weapons, not sure I’d want to find out, but their presence seems to be an awfully good deterrent. I have a feeling the OPD would think twice, probably three times, if they came to Oakland. I’d sure wouldn’t want to mess with them.
Not that I want to see violence, but reading stories like this makes me so angry. Damn bullies!
Funny how that works isn’t it?
The state of Arizona allows the exercise of
Constitutional freedoms like that on the street.
The state of California does not. In fact they just
passed a state law that you cannot carry UNloaded
weapons on the street as you once could.
Every able bodied man on the street at the demonstrations should carry a nice thick walking stick. They also double as shoulder mounted sign carriers. Oops, I forgot, the California Penal code dictates that protest signs can only be mounted on 1/4″ by 2″ thick lath sticks.
For reference (youtube, Occupy Phoenix)
Images of Oakland’s finest thugs are chilling — like an inhuman phalanx of armor-clad imperial storm troopers:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/nov/04/occupy-oakland-second-veteran-injured
This is becoming a pattern. They appear to be doing their utmost to provoke and incite violence, not quell it. My guess is that like media and politicians, they’re flummoxed by the Occupy Movement’s insistent nonviolence and their determined lack of “negotiating points”. It’s becoming a tar baby. They’re trying to light it up in order to put it down. The Shock Doctrine formula of shock and awe isn’t quite going as planned.
http://dailybail.com/home/video-oakland-police-were-embedded-in-occupy-oaklands-camp-b.html
As my long-time activist friend says, “The first one to suggest violence is always the government agent.”
I think they’re going to get what they want soon.
They are going to come down on the wrong people and there is going to be dead pigs in the gutter then all bets will be off and they won’t leave their sty unless they are heavily armed and then they will be fair game for all true patriots.
They are way overdue for some straightenin out.
I’m thinking Tim McVeigh might pay a visit.
there are no such things as non-lethal rounds. Some are less frequently lethal than others, but none are non-lethal. Another Reuters fib.
And didn’t they deny using “non-lethal” rounds last time, trying to pin it on other groups, saying they didn’t have approval to use them? Or was that just the rubber bullets and they were using different “non-lethal” rounds, e.g. stratified pinpoint accuracy beanbag rounds (not that I have a clue what those are, but I think I can sorta guess the general idea)?
I’d like to see a few ex-Rangers on “the 10 yard line” next time we see an Occuoy protest! Might give those Twinkie-munching nitwits a little to think about before they next “take action” … The training up of a skilled and seasoned army of veterans and patriots over the last 10 years might end up being the thin d line that preserves what is left of American democracy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQsqlA3nS1E
Not endorsing his view BTW. Any job below investment banking is beneath us.
“…job below investment banking…”
Impossible.
If we had leadership, the unprovoked attacks on servicemen would have been a cause of commander-in-chief alarm voiced with clarity and absolute rejection.
If we had free media, attacks on soldiers that are otherwise accepted as heroes would have been widely publicized and rejected instead of reading about it in a British paper.
Recognizing that I volunteered as a Ranger, fully knowing the hazards of my chosen profession, I will always endeavor to uphold the prestige, honor, and high esprit de corps of my Ranger Regiment.
Acknowledging the fact that a Ranger is a more elite soldier who arrives at the cutting edge of battle by land, sea, or air, I accept the fact that as a Ranger my country expects me to move further, faster and fight harder than any other soldier.
Never shall I fail my comrades. I will always keep myself mentally alert, physically strong and morally straight and I will shoulder more than my share of the task whatever it may be, one-hundred-percent and then some.
Gallantly will I show the world that I am a specially selected and well-trained soldier. My courtesy to superior officers, neatness of dress and care of equipment shall set the example for others to follow.
Energetically will I meet the enemies of my country. I shall defeat them on the field of battle for I am better trained and will fight with all my might. Surrender is not a Ranger word. I will never leave a fallen comrade to fall into the hands of the enemy and under no circumstances will I ever embarrass my country.
Readily will I display the intestinal fortitude required to fight on to the Ranger objective and complete the mission though I be the lone survivor.
—Ranger Handbook SH 21-76[1]
Skippy…If and when fact can be established, to these events, that the out come would be that this person was unduly attacked…
Skippy “Recognizing that I volunteered as a Ranger, fully knowing the hazards of my chosen profession …’
Written in the first person with attribution in full to a manual -its confusing.
Could you clarify. Are you the Ranger speaking?
Skippy’s whole quotation is from the Ranger Creed
https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Ranger_Creed
RGR 1st 75th HAAF, Savannah GA.
Its be awhile since I’ve had tears run down my cheeks. No bawling, no sniffing, no change in breathing, just tears running down my face.
http://maps.google.com.au/maps?oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&q=Savannah+GA.+oglethorpe+mall&fb=1&gl=au&hq=oglethorpe+mall&hnear=0x88fb75fc78f20659:0x4e0c6751036020bc,Savannah,+GA,+USA&cid=0,0,8202028011205318403&ei=PlK1Tof9FcSeiAeHz9X1AQ&sa=X&oi=local_result&ct=image&ved=0CAgQ_BI
Skippy…Its a hell of a thing, to spend a month in the Panamanian jungle. Come back to your base, walking straight into the shower, full gear and all. Square it all way then head out to the biggest feed you can find. Afterwards hit River St. to get on the piss or Oglethorpe Mall for a movie. Always calling your Company desk every 30 mins or upon changing location, Bravo alert status. Half way through the movie some kid attendant runs down the center aisle yelling all Rangers Alpha alert. Shit…stand up to see a few others spread out in the theater, rip ass thought the mall, blow lights back to base and lock down. Land lines cut, razor wire up, 4 or more equipment checks, alert gear palatalized, head to staging area on runway, Back into a C-141 (not hours ago you were dog piled into for how much time???), its after midnight now, disembark and head out on a 12 mile speed march. Next morning someone on you floor wakes up in their camos, wandering the hallway…WTF did I do last night…he had taken option one…River St. piss up.
PS. the guys will be chatting about this, RECON the situation. Depending on that out come, it will be interesting how they respond. First a Marine, now a Ranger, these are folks that gave a lot, of them selves, for what ever reasons, rightly or wrongly. But all pass thought a gate of sorts_together_bonded. IMO Rangers is a all volunteer unit[s, high injury and casualty training rate. You have to_want_…to be there.
SO RANGER JUST WHAT DOES ALL THAT MEAN? YOU ARE NOT WITH YOUR BROTHER WHO WAS BEATEN CONFUSED PLEASE EXPLAIN THANKS ?
Rangers don’t fight stupidly. And if you look at the creed the answer to your question resides within.
Skippy…you incite violence when that is just what your enemy wants. Rule number one, never do what your enemy wants or expects. I hope you are not on the side I fight with, fore you put more people in harms way or dead.
PS. do you work for the elites and is your name really beard?
If the Goons (be they police, or any of Officialdom’s myriad agents provocateurs)keep this up, they are not only going to kill someone, but also trigger an explosion – the Junta that runs the US is still so arrogantly contemptuous of the public, they remain blissfully unaware of just how pissed off many tens of millions of people are; that UNLIKE during Vietnam/the “60’s” it cuts across the entire political/social spectrum; that it is far more directed UP, as opposed to at each other: and that a huge number of people possess arms. They pull this brutish crap with the the wrong person(s) and there’s a real possibility of serious violence.
NO violence.
Skippy,
No one with more than one functioning brain cell wants violence to take place.
Now, provocations and violence from law enforcement MUST be curbed for peace to be kept.
There is only so much people already frazzled and close to despair will take without striking back.
Francois T…
I hold you in high regard, yet, I would say that to turn your_enemy’s strength_into their_biggest weakness_is a cornerstone in any strategy. Frontal confrontations were used in our Civil War, WWI & WWII, and Vietnam. We know the out comes of this strategy…attrition…those with better resources and willingness to sacrifice body’s…win.
And look, the President as commander in chief has access to units that don’t require congressional approval plus the patriot act. Now lets not forget those landed private army’s we have roaming around. Would any corporation or incorporated (<snicker) city – towns wish to beef up their security apparatus, well history tells me a tale.
As already shown when vets took to wall st, in an orderly fashion, zero chatter, more disciplined than the police +, full of grim determination, whom looked the most nervous – unsettled…eh. The entire premise of US law is protection of property and not human well being e.g. a police officers equipment is government property, the roads, any thing that effects commerce, buildings.
Skippy…as much as we wish, as much as we might, you cannot fight them on their own terms, its designed that way. And do not forget what Bushie said "its just a piece of paper" of which several draft were constructed till they we ALL happy with it. Cheers Francois.
They pull this brutish crap with the the wrong person(s) and there’s a real possibility of serious violence.
That’s what the Mayor and Police hope for: that they can find that “wrong person(s)” whose actions will justify further violence on the part of the authorities.
NO violence. Make ’em squirm. Mistakes will then be made and they will be defeated by the wave of public opinion.
The police really need to restrain themselves even if they are ordered to beat people up by their superiors and the politicians. They need emotional training to handle the stress better and strong leadership that supports their restraint in using force. They also need to stop using steroids and other drugs that make them so easy to anger. Finally, any of these police that have hurt a citizen need to be disciplined/fined/punished for any illegal or excessive use of force.
Police have been trained for military engagement and attitudes toward the public.
repeat
Police have been trained for military engagement and attitudes toward the public.
and chosen for brutality and sadism hmmm?
I’ll just say this: I, with a perfect score on the civil service police exam and a flawless background and character check, was deemed psychologically disqualified by the NYPD Psych Unit and dropped from the selection process because I foolishly admitted having seen a therapist about some depression issues.
Justin Volpe, who sodomized a prisoner with a toilet plunger handle, was allowed onto the force.
Same observation to the military. When asked during formal indoctrination you are asked similar questions. Do you or any member of your family have a history of mental illness, have you ever used drugs, etc.
I actually saw one guy in front of me say yes to smoking pot. The SSG gave him a few moments and then a big look in the eyes. Well it finally dawned on him, no SSG I have not used drugs…. SSG…next. I would also add, caveat here, my opinion. That for the last ten years anyone asking for mental help is diminished as an individual, seen as defective (a failure of the system to instill killer instincts with out reflection), and that any signs of self realization are to be stomped out immediately or discharged. Sent to a grossly unfunded support net work where it is hoped they will just fall off the earth or end up in jail (profit there SOK).
Any one that survives and makes good enough money, is to be held up as a poster boy that faith heals all and shall be rewarded.
Skippy…Have a friend that got clean up duty on the Baghdad highway (first frackus). Nice guy, showed me photos (good photographer and nice camera), anyway he lives life and makes money. Yet in over near 20 years he can’t keep a relationship going for more than a year. In fact I would offer that since the Arab wars started the effect is just the opposite of WWII
Gents, this is an interesting exchange. It explains, a little, why I was bamboozled out of enlisting in the Army some years ago. I was out of work, and desperate, so I went into the Times Square recruiting station. I picked the Translation/Intelligence job, because it paid the most AND I already had a Linguistics BA. I had the highest scores on the tests in 10 years.
At 34, I passed the physical w/flying colors. Then we had the “psych” discussion. I admitted I had been raped in the past. All of sudden, I needed 3 psych exams. Passed the first two, the third was rescheduled multiple time UNTIL I was past the (then) cut-off age of 35. This after my recruiter told me they accepted guys who beat up their girlfriends. Was told I could go into the reserves, where there was no translator job.
Tried to pursue with ACLU; they were very dismissive.
Learn something new every day.
Many Americans (perhaps most, but certainly not people of color, the poor and homeless, immigrants, i.e., the people with no power) favored the decades long policies of militarizing police forces, the War on Drugs, harsh penal and sentencing laws, prisons, prisons and more prisons. Well, people, we will reap what has been sowed. Chomsky observes that the overt, brutal oppression of “classical” fascism doesn’t obtain here: propaganda, acquiescence, passivity, pharamaceuticals (has any society in history taken more drugs than ours?) are sufficient social controls, and that US elites will be unable to institute more violent controls. He may be selling our elites short in inhuman depravity. Certainly, the savagery of US militarized foreign policy can, conceptually, translate to the domestic arena. If and when US royalty feel fear, then we may all be beaten into submission, like our vet here. God bless him.
remember during the viet war the war will come home?
This is a little O/T, but personally, I think the widespread use of i-gadgets is adding to this, promoting anomie, distraction, and severing communication and exchange between the physically proximate.
I know they help the Occupy movement organize and communicate, but Occupy has also had to revive physical proximity as necessary protest weapon.
The police in California in general — and the Oakland and LA police in particular — are a crazily violent and dangerous bunch, however worthy individual officers may be. They are rarely held accountable except for the most heinous crimes of assault and murder. In LA, where I lived for fifteen years, gunplay involving the police (LAPD and LA , Riverside, and San Bernardino deputy sheriffs) is so common that when they kill someone the LA Times rarely runs the event on the front page unless the victim is white.
There was a reason the Black Panther Party was founded in Oakland in 1966 by Huey Newton and Bobby Seale. Its original name was “The Black Panther Party for Self-Defense”. The regularly appeared in front of public court houses with law books and guns in hand, quoting the US Constitution on the 2nd Amendment, the right to bear arms and the first amendment, the right to assemble and petition the government and free speech.
More recently, a transit cop was convicted of killing, shooting in the back while lying on the ground of a BART train, a young Black man, 22, celebrating New Years Eve. His conviction for man slaughter caused violent street protests in Oakland last year at the end of the trial. There is no doubt, that in addition to #OWS inspired Occupy Oakland participants, that other groups and individuals with long standing political grievances are out in force in Oakland. There is a level of activism in that city that explains so much of the good, large turn out at the port, as well as the vandalism in the downtown business district at the same time. There is a very broad spectrum of political organizations as well as ongoing contributory factors of police brutality to create the volatile behavior in Oakland.
To see a local Oakland group and there archives of political struggle there, please see this link:
http://oaklandnorth.net/many-movements-one-struggle/
Police (powers) must be restrained and be held accountable. This is f””g disgusting.
One of the reasons I love NC, is because it has it all.
See this article from last year:
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2010/06/gonzalo-lira-is-the-u-s-a-fascist-police-state.html
You have been warned.
I predict that when the US Army is finally deployed to deal with the protesters, Oakland will be their first theater of operations.
You are not paying attention, they already are.
Large number of vets go into the police when they get out.
If you think the difference is the _less lethal_ weaponry, then two points. One, all weaponry is lethal if used correctly. Two, the standard ammunition is back at the station, if not already on site, and the _police_ will have no compunction using it.
Occupy renamed the Plaza to Oscar Grant Plaza for lots of reasons. Make no mistake, everyone can be an Oscar Grant.
What are our guys doing dying for
“our”?? “freedoms” in Iraq and Afghanistan when they could be back on the streets of our country standing up for
them and then sleeping in their own bed at night?
The second mobilization of our military should be when they return from duty overseas and begin their real duty
to defend the Constitution and our nation from enemies, foreign and domestic…occupy Wall Street is the right place.
Durring the WTO riots in Seattle, I noticed my pet was out of food, so I decided to walk down to the local grocery.
The protesters had pushed the police up from downtown into my neighborhood, and a little tear gas was drifting through the streets. I still thought it would be OK… Seattle cops are cool… and the protesters peacefull.
On the way to the store, I passed the ‘front’ line. 200-300 peacefull protesters singing and linked hands. A police barricade of 50 officers. It was peacefull.
6 twenty-somethings all dressed in black were ripping bricks from the sidewalk. I talked to kids dressed in black, and they told me they were anarchists. They told me violence was the only way to make change happen. They told me the cops were scared since they were pushed to 3 block to their precinct. They told me all kinds of crazy things.
I left, and went to the store. The manager was at the front door, and wouldn’t let me in :( I asked pretty please, explained the pet food problem, and he gave me a look like I was crazy.
I turned around, and there was clouds of tear gas. Guns were going off. I went back and saw cops going crazy. I saw peacefull protests getting shot (rubber bullets, bean bags), gassed, and beaten. The cops even dragged some girl out of her truck (who was filming) and beat her. I ran. The news crews were running too. It was bad.
What I didn’t see were any of the anarchists. Since they were in the back, they were the first ones to get away.
What I learned was:
1) 6 people can turn a peacefull protest into a violent one.
2) The cops win violent protests.
3) They make movies out of violent protests, not peacefull ones.
4) Don’t go to the store durring a protest.
I think I actually saw that footage. The protestor was not confronting the cop as a line of cops rushed the protestors, pushing them back. Then the protestors straggled forward and the cops pushed back again. Then without provocation one beefy cop suddenly, quickly lunged forward like he was doing a fencing thrust and jabbed his nightstick into the soft left side of a protestor. It was a very strategic move. The cop knew exactly what he was doing and he did it hard. The protestor quickly doubled over and began to complain. That’s all I saw. I was attempted murder.
Keep it up cops! One day you will beat up the wrong Vet and discover you should not mess with trained killers.
It’s tempting to wonder which of these Oakland police graduated from the Philippine Police Academy and when. Regardless, they do seem to have been issued the updated release on the CIA’s guidebook for “maintaining stability”.
(1) So far, this beating has been all but ignored by the press, with much of what coverage there is of the “well he SAID …” sort. This squares well with what a civil rights lawyer once told me regarding the police: If there’s no video, it didn’t happen. (If the cops took some and it’s unfavorable, it will be “lost”.)
(2) There is absolutely ZERO need for our police to be armed as they are. This stuff needs to be taken away from them, as they have demonstrated that they are incapable of using it properly.
(3) Memo to #OCCUPIERS: Demand protection from the Justice Department. Eric Holder has done nothing for three years. It’s time for him to either start or resign.
(4) “Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.”
John F. Kennedy, In a speech at the White House, 1962
Keep Dreaming about Holder doing anything.
He is too busy trying to cover his tail in regards to the gun running charges.
The Justice Department is right down the street from the Ministry of Truth.
anyone know how kayvan is doing??
So far this sounds like another instance of a summary conviction for “contempt of cop”. Some of them are more than ready to teach citizens a lesson if they are not properly defferential in respecting police auhtori-TIE.
I wonder if the Oakland Police Association will send another “we are confused” letter to the citizens like they did after they busted the first vet’s head open:
http://dailybail.com/home/we-are-confused-an-open-letter-to-citizens-of-oakland-from-t.html
Sadly, it takes a veteran to get some peoples attention. I guess if youre not a vet and youre beaten up, it doesnt count.
Unfortunately the 60’s were about social justice. This time its about money. I dont think we will win.
It was about money in 1918 in Russia and in 1789 in France. Who won?
More optimistically, it was about money in 1932 in the US. Who won?
It is because it is about money that we are *guaranteed* to win. It is specifically because the people currently trying to steal all the money are gross incompetents.
To paraphrase what someone wrote recently, “They want to rule the world as economic dictators. And the thing is, we’d probably just let them do it, if they were any good at it, but they’re not.”
The Pharoah knew that he had to keep all of Egypt fed and employed, or he would be overthrown. Somehow, most of our 0.1% doesn’t understand this. Hell, a good pyramid-building program would probably calm everyone right down *but they just won’t do it*.
The issue, to be clear, is how much of a bloody mess it is going to be before we win.
We would like it to be as peaceful and orderly as possible.
There is that JFK quote though.
The civil rights marchers had security enforcers on the outsides of the marchers. Anybody who started a violent act got grabbed really quickly.
The OWS people have to adopt the same tactics. They need people to grab and sit on the “anarchists”. And, this is important: they need to strip-search the bastard before the police get him, or duct-tape themselves to the guy. This will help them keep govt. provocateurs in place so they can memorize the faces.
All faces and body should be easily designable, peaceful in appearance, not hiding weapons, don’t dress up nor down.
Skippy…occupy your country.
Now is a good time to revisit our American history, specifically the Bonus Army, and how Patton, MacArthur, Eisenhower and other fine soldiers fired upon US citizens:
https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Bonus_Army
“President Herbert Hoover then ordered the army to clear the veterans’ campsite. Army Chief of Staff General Douglas MacArthur commanded the infantry and cavalry supported by six tanks. The Bonus Army marchers with their wives and children were driven out, and their shelters and belongings burned.”
these cops are causing there own war and people arent camping over night. and yet arent beeing arrested for attempted murder